Conversations between the public and private sector

Our work means that we sit in a unique position that crosses sector boundaries.

We have worked across several built environment sectors, including design, architecture, real estate, landscape, planning and engineering. We’ve found that misunderstandings can occur across these sectors as well as the private, public, and third sectors. We see our magazine as an opportunity for us to create a space for conversation and clarity.

With this in mind, when preparing content for our magazine Public Notice, we spoke with Angela Barnicle and Alison Dowsett about their experiences working in the built environment industry to better understand where they see opportunities to build empathy, understanding and common ground across the public and private sectors.

The following conversation took place in November last year.

Angela: I’d start by saying I’m a geographer; I’ve always been curious about place. I studied geography at university and then worked at Leeds City Council, but I quickly realised that policy wasn’t for me; I wanted to build things. I was fortunate to train to be a commercial practice surveyor at Leeds. After that, I went to work in the private sector. I wanted to work on significant city schemes through the UK, which took me to Belfast to write and then stay to implement new city strategy. After this, a position came up in Leeds, where my children still attended school, so I returned to the council and have been in this role for six years. There’s nothing more compelling than being held to account by your children.

Alison: That is amazing, Angela. I only have one degree, not three! However, I’m also a geographer. I studied surveying at Reading University, and one of my specialisms was development. I was fascinated by development and the ability to transform, build and influence places. I started work in the recession in the 1990s for a house builder. Like Angela, I wanted to be involved in the doing rather than the advising, so I’ve always worked on the client side, doing the building and delivering. I have worked at Berkeley for 20 years, which sounds like a long time, but that’s included some very different and challenging roles over the years.

Alison: At Berkeley, we’re predominantly building in London, as well as the wider South East and Birmingham. The idea that Levelling Up benefits the North rather than the South has been frustrating. There is a significant amount of Levelling Up needed in London. Over the last 15 years, we’ve moved towards developing large regeneration schemes on brownfield land, often in areas facing the most significant inequalities and challenges, to improve neighbourhoods and the quality of life. We look at the long-term; it’s much more than building homes. We consider how we affect what’s inside and outside the red line, including the impact on the broader community, new affordable homes and jobs.

Angela: I agree that geographic reference to Levelling Up has always been unhelpful. We need a thriving London and a thriving Leeds. Leeds is only one of two regional cities that gives more back to the treasury than it costs. Levelling Up is about everybody getting the bespoke toolkit they need for their place to prosper. Leeds is one of three places that DLUHC (now MHCLG) is working with to develop a tailored toolkit to accelerate housing and regeneration. For the last decade, regeneration has been about just one part of regeneration - place-based. The built environment is just one part of the solution; to tackle total regeneration, place, economic and social regeneration must work together. We will see accelerated and meaningful progress only when we hit all three parts of that equation.

Angela: Perception and reality are two different things, but they’re both equally important. I always say start with empathy, not opinion. Understanding needs and what’s driving them is absolutely crucial. The built environment is less about place and more about people, and that’s the same for perception. Having had the experience of working on both sides makes you more empathetic, but I don’t think you have to work on both sides to understand it. Things like job and skills sharing are critical.

Alison: House building, development, and growth are real forces for good. The common ground between developers and planners is much broader than people think. If you focus on outcomes, not processes, we can show something tangible and improve perception. We’ve had the most success when we’ve joined genuine partnerships with trust.

Alison: The big challenge is to reverse the fall we've seen in housing delivery and placemaking. It will take real focus, radical thinking and close collaboration across the private and public sectors. But those conversations are now happening, and many of the challenges holding back housing supply can be overcome quickly. Another challenge is for local authorities to secure long-term funding to rebuild capacity in their hugely important planning and regeneration teams. These teams are vital to driving growth, housing delivery, and net zero and do a tremendous amount of good in their local communities.

We're also looking forward to the national rollout of biodiversity net gain, which will be such a significant step forward for the industry.

Angela: You have to have a clear vision that’s evidence-based, and people can buy into. The capacity to deliver in local government is not what it was ten years ago; if you don’t have strong local government, that undermines the ability to deliver and create a clear vision. Addressing and fixing these challenges together will be critical for us to get through the next three to five years. In Leeds, we’re mindful that whilst we are the city’s council, this isn’t the council’s city. Local ownership of collective and sustainable growth, but importantly, change for everybody, is critical. As we move forward, having a locally-owned inclusive growth strategy is going to be essential, but we must be mindful that the capacity and the skills to do it are under real pressure.